Climate, Energy and Environment Committee - Tuesday 22 July 2025, 2:00pm - West Yorkshire Combined Authority Webcasting

Climate, Energy and Environment Committee
Tuesday, 22nd July 2025 at 2:00pm 

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  1. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  2. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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  1. Rotimi Olorunfemi
  2. Rotimi Olorunfemi
  3. Cllr Mohan Sokhal
  4. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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  1. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
  2. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  3. Mr Neil Whalley, Advisory Representative (Northern Gas Networks)
  4. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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Share this agenda point
  1. Fatima Khan-Shah (Inclusivity Champion)
  2. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  3. Cllr Mohan Sokhal
  4. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  5. Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council
  6. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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  1. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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  1. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
  2. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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  1. Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  2. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  3. Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  4. Matthew Page
  5. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  6. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  7. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
  8. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  9. Matthew Page
  10. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  11. Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council
  12. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  13. Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  14. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  15. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
  16. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  17. Adam Ashman, Advisory Representative (Yorkshire Water)
  18. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  19. Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  20. Adam Ashman, Advisory Representative (Yorkshire Water)
  21. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  22. Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  23. Matthew Page
  24. Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  25. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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  1. Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  2. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  3. Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  4. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  5. Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council
  6. Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  7. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  8. Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  9. Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council
  10. Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  11. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  12. Fatima Khan-Shah (Inclusivity Champion)
  13. Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  14. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  15. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  16. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
  17. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  18. Cllr Mohan Sokhal
  19. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  20. Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  21. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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  1. Michelle Hunter, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  2. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  3. Martyn Broadest, Advisory Representative (West Yorks Housing Partnership)
  4. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  5. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
  6. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  7. Fatima Khan-Shah (Inclusivity Champion)
  8. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  9. Cllr Mohan Sokhal
  10. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  11. Michelle Hunter, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  12. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  13. Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council
  14. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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  1. Mia Higgins
  2. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  3. Martyn Broadest, Advisory Representative (West Yorks Housing Partnership)
  4. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  5. Fatima Khan-Shah (Inclusivity Champion)
  6. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  7. Mia Higgins
  8. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  9. Cllr Mohan Sokhal
  10. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  11. Mr Neil Whalley, Advisory Representative (Northern Gas Networks)
  12. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  13. Martyn Broadest, Advisory Representative (West Yorks Housing Partnership)
  14. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  15. Jessica McNeil West Yorkshire Combined Authority
  16. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  17. Jessica McNeil West Yorkshire Combined Authority
  18. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  19. Liz Hunter, Director (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  20. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  21. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
  22. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  23. Mia Higgins
  24. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  25. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
  26. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  27. Cllr Mohan Sokhal
  28. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  29. Liz Hunter, Director (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  30. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
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  1. Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  2. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  3. John Clark (Private Sector Representative)
  4. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  5. Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  6. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  7. Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  8. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  9. Alex Clarke, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  10. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  11. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
  12. Cllr Mohan Sokhal
  13. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  14. Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative)
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  1. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  2. Alex Clarke, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  3. Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  4. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  5. Alex Clarke, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  6. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  7. John Clark (Private Sector Representative)
  8. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  9. Jim Cardwell, Advisory Representative (Northern Powergrid)
  10. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  11. Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  12. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  13. Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council
  14. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  15. Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority)
  16. Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council)
  17. Webcast Finished

Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:00:00
A very warm welcome to you this afternoon. I'm Councillor Jane Skelian, I'm the leader
of Colderdale Council and I'm the chair of the Climate, Energy and Environment Committee
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:00:14
and a very warm welcome to those who are joining us for the first time. We've just had a brief
discussion, the director and I, and because it's an extremely well attended committee,
committee, we did think about the usual going round plus icebreaker and what you had for
breakfast, but we decided that was actually going to take a little too long. So I think
when you speak for the first time, if you perhaps could just introduce yourself at that
moment, your name, if that's acceptable. But for those of you who are attending for the
first time, a very warm welcome. Now, the first item on the agenda today is
apologies for absence.

1 Apologies for Absence

Oh, beg your pardon.
Just to say, you will have had this in your invitation,
but just a reminder that at the rising
of this committee meeting,
there is a short workshop for committee members.
So if you can possibly stay for that.
If you can remember not to rush away, that would be great.
Okay, on to item one, apologies.
Thanks.
Rotimi, can you confirm whether there are any apologies this afternoon?
Thank you very much.
Rotimi Olorunfemi - 0:01:32
Rotimi Olorunfemi - 0:01:45
Leah Stewart and Leanne Holmes.
Thank you.
Councillor Soquel.
Can we make you introduce yourself first?
Sorry, I'm here for the Councillor Tyler Hawken from representing Kirkleigh Council.
Cllr Mohan Sokhal - 0:02:09
I'm on the Kirkleigh Council for a long, long time, 36 years.
I'm the survey Councillor on the Kirkleigh Council.
I'm here for Councillor Tyler Hawken. I'm not taking too much time. Thank you.
Thank you, Councillor Soquel and it's Kirklees Council and we thank you for your service that is impressive actually
26 years and I'm sure we'll meet Councillor Hawkins in due course
Thank you Rotimi
Next item is declarations of interest

2 Declaration of Disclosable Pecuniary Interests

Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:02:41
Is there anybody on the committee who's got interests that they wish to declare in any item on the agenda?
Gideon
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 0:02:53
Yeah, Gideon Richards. I don't know if it is a conflict of interest, but I'll say it anyway, so my wife
Councillor see Lee Richards, it's on the white rose pop one of the right rose forest
committees
Whatever it is, I don't know but she's on it. So just so we know
Thank you, and that is an item on today's agenda. So thank you just for making that clear
I don't think it's a pecuniary interest in any way, but thank you for being clear
Yeah
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:03:23
Mr Neil Whalley, Advisory Representative (Northern Gas Networks) - 0:03:28
New all the northern gas networks similar vein to that would have funded member of white rose forest. So just declare that
Thank you
Any more for any more?
Nope and there aren't any items on flooding on the agenda, so I don't have to do my usual my usual flooding declaration
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:03:48
Thank you. Moving on to item 3, exclusion of the press and the public.
And I understand there are no items today which means we can just press on as normal.

3 Exempt Information - Possible Exclusion of the Press and Public

I just wanted to say that there are no financial decisions on the agenda this afternoon.
And the items before you and the committee are for endorsing or for noting,
to give your input or to steer the work in a particular direction and with your
permission committee I'd very much like to try and allow enough time for some of
the items that are later on the agenda to do with transport because I do know
that this committee were keen to actually just have their hands across
some of the links between the climate agenda and the transport agenda so
Perhaps if we were fairly brisk in the first half of this agenda and then move on to the transport items
So my next item don't sing any dissension
My next item is the minutes of the meeting held on the 25th of March

4 Minutes of the Meeting of the Climate, Energy and Environment Committee held on 25 March 2025

Any members have further comments or questions on those fat Fatima
Fatima Khan-Shah (Inclusivity Champion) - 0:05:08
Hello everybody. This is my first meeting. My name is Fatima Khan Shah. I am the mayor's inclusivity champion and chair
I just wanted to draw colleagues attention to paragraph 17
Referring to the chairs update just to clarify
I think of miscommunication reflected in the minutes and I was awaiting the notice to committees to inform people of
Not attending the meeting last time but the way in which it frames suggests that I was invited and I chose not to attend
Which I would never dream of doing in a meeting that you're there
And so I just wanted it to be amended to sort of reflect the accuracy which was that I intend to attend future meetings
And here I am
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:05:43
Fatima thank you very much for that. I'm really glad to have you rotami. Can you make sure that the minutes are amended if that's
accepted
Are we content with that correction to confirm these minutes as an accurate record?
Something just basically leads is I think Councillor Hemingway was on this committee
Cllr Mohan Sokhal - 0:06:07
from Wakefield and raised something about producing some sort of smart sort of targets
and maybe producing given the reports are very comprehensive but perhaps producing something
like a plan on a page when big reports are going forward.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:06:29
I am not sure if I can get the floor up.
That sounds like a very good idea and the kind of thing we do in the West Yorkshire
Combined Authority. I was on sick leave at the last meeting, a cancer patient. Liz, I
am looking to you in terms of Councillor Hemingway's comments. Obviously it wasn't recorded.
Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council - 0:06:57
I think I'm aware of the email thread where this might have come from and may perhaps we can take it offline in terms of how
We manage it. I think some of that is already happening
But I do I think this might be for a specific item that this was being brought to the attention
So we'll pick it up afterwards. Okay
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:07:15
Consider a fee cuz that's okay to take off online. Thank you for that prompt really appreciate it

5 Governance Arrangements

Okay content to confirm these as an accurate record. I'm seeing nonce. Thank you very much

4 Minutes of the Meeting of the Climate, Energy and Environment Committee held on 25 March 2025

5 Governance Arrangements

Now, moving on to item five, this is actually the first committee of the municipal year.
It's not the same as the calendar year, it's not the same as the financial year, it's this
peculiar animal called the municipal year.
And of course, in a normal year, this would have been after the elections.
elections and we have long history, a fallow year in terms of local government elections
and of course there were no mail elections this year. So this is the first meeting of
the municipal year, hence this item in front of you this afternoon in terms of reference
and membership of the committee. I want to say first of all to those who served last
chair, thank you for serving on the committee and thank you for your contributions. I'm
sorry illness meant that I wasn't able to be at all of the meetings but I have enjoyed
tremendously and really appreciated the contributions that you've made. Thank you.
And we have then in front of us the setting out of the arrangements for the governance
for the committee this year. It has already been to the full West Shoreshire combined
authority. So this is in fact already agreed and it's here for the committee to note the
terms of reference and the membership. Key thing I want you to make sure that you have,
whether you're a main member or a substitute member, the key thing I want you to have is
the dates for the coming year that are already fixed. Now there may be other workshops or
other meetings but these are the dates of the main full committee and that's
the 22nd of July the 4th of 4th of November and the 17th of March so
22nd of July today of course the 4th of November and the 17th of March as I say
we do have other meetings in between and indeed a number of workshops and similar events.
Those key things. Of course, they only go up to March because of course there is another round of political elections in May 26.
Now in terms of the report, you will see there is both the terms of reference which are unchanged
I think from last year and there is also the membership table and I have got still a couple
of queries and I don't know if officers or those present can fill in the necessary names.
we're still waiting for subs to be confirmed from Leeds Council and York
Council. Do we have any further information on those? Nope, nope, okay we'll
wait for those and look forward to seeing seeing those folks. Any comments
or questions. Fatima. Just to acknowledge chair that as the mayor's advisor on
inclusion that I have the opportunity and privilege of attending all the
committees but it's not reflected within the list of members so it's just to
reflect that I hope to continue to be able to attend the committee with the
support of yourself. Lovely thank you and can that be recorded and perhaps just
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:11:14
picked up in terms of the other committees because I know there's a few
Coming up just to make sure that that's properly represented. Thank you
Not seeing MDLs on this item and the recommendations that committee notes the governance arrangements already approved by the
authority
So if people are content, I will then move on to the chairs update

6 Chair's Update

on items six and and I
want you to
just update on some key work streams from the committee.
But first of all, I wanted to reflect
on the continuing drought conditions in the region.
And if there are any climate change deniers in the room,
I think some of the extreme weather events we're having
might help to change their minds, really,
in terms of we had flash flooding in Col d 'Odile yesterday
at the same time as we are having a drought. And as members of the
committee will be aware, a hosepipe ban came into place on the 11th of July and
I very sadly as the leader of one of the district councils had to sign the
order which basically stopped all the water play in our parks as a not
essential, you could argue the point, not essential use of water and I know that
other authorities have had to do that thing.
And the region's officially in drought conditions,
and these announcements follow the driest spring on record.
And those records go back a very long way.
And obviously we know this because we know a lot
about flooding and catchment and water supply
and water assets like reservoirs and the distribution network.
Actually, the usage of this resource and the importance of this resource by our local communities,
our local businesses is obviously key. And some of you will remember the drought in 95, 96.
And I do remember, for example, old people's homes having to have bottled water,
and bowsers coming into communities and streets,
and actually being some unrest and unhappiness
around those things.
I do hope that we won't be in the same situation again,
but clearly we know how important that is.
And if you see the reservoirs for those of us
that are in the uplands and hilltops,
what is in the reservoirs is just extraordinary.
It would take a very long time to fill those reservoirs up.
Linked to this, DEFRA are currently consulting on changes to the funding approach for flood
risk management. One of the elements of that consultation I think you might be interested
in is thinking not just about the building of new assets, obviously we're talking about,
and new assets particularly in relation to flood risk management, walls and culverts
and so on. One of the elements that DEFRA are consulting on is how we maintain existing
assets. I think investing in new capital infrastructure is really important and investing in natural
flood management is really important. But actually there are things like reservoir walls,
our pipe system, what's underneath our highways and so on, thinking about our current assets
and how we make sure, if you look at the map, I don't know if it's there, it's over behind
Mia at the end of the room. If you look at the map of West Yorkshire and you see our
enormous rural hinterland where we have so many reservoirs and we provide clean water
to so many cities and towns and villages, actually how important that is to us here
in Yorkshire. So I really recommend that in your organisations and your councils that
you take a look at that Defra consultation, particularly around the question of how do
we make sure that our assets are properly protected. I just wanted to say before I leave
the question of drought, it's really hard as a politician to, for people that you talk
to in your boroughs, to get their heads around the fact that it's raining, they're not allowed
to use their hose pipes, the children's play parks have got no water features and there
water -burst pipes in the streets and actually squaring that circle and trying
to explain people why actually the hosepipe ban is important that we do
reduce our water usage is really hard and as a country and in terms of our
infrastructure we need to really get to get to grips with that and when there
was a cloud burst yesterday we had flooding of some of our highways and
and things like supermarkets, car parks.
Yesterday, people were mourning a lot about the drought
and the hosepipe ban.
Okay, so I'm just going to quickly move on
to another couple of items in my chair's report.
One of them is in relation to biodiversity net gain,
BNG as the officer's abbreviation has it.
And just to flag up the introduction
of the mandatory biodiversity net gain requirements that we all have to meet. It's a very significant
shift for developers and again DEFRA, the department, want to explore some early opportunities
to reduce what they call process burdens, what you would also call red tape and bureaucracy
policy in terms of trying to deliver for nature in an area like West Yorkshire, but also make
sure that the whole system doesn't become so bureaucratic that it doesn't work for anybody.
And they're particularly looking to see where changes could be implemented for small and
medium -sized developers. Now that's important to us in West Yorkshire. We of
course love Barrett's and all of the big volume house builders of course but we
also know that we have a number of other small and medium -sized enterprises in
West Yorkshire. Now the officers in the combined authority are coordinating with
the planning officers in the districts trying to develop a response to the
consultation and just see how we might actually look at small -scale developments and biodiversity
net gain and how do we make that bearable and manageable for small developments because
I certainly know that in places like Coldertale where you're doing infill and you've got small
amount of land that doesn't flood and isn't on the hilltops. It's really important to
think about that. We don't want to see those often very, very good, very sustainable developments
stymied because of the biodiversity net gain that would cancel out the good things. So
your views are very much, again, take a look at that DEFRA consultation, talk to the combined
authority officers and just see if there's some suggestions we've got. Gabriel, can I
bring you in.
Yeah, thanks.
Just a quick one.
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 0:18:56
And when we say developments, I hope
we're not just talking about housing,
because we've got an issue at the moment with a community
centre where the biodiversity net gain is just
going to mess up everything.
So I think it's the whole side of it.
Thank you, Gideon.
Apologies for calling you Gabriel.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:19:20
I don't know whether I'm having a senior moment
or whether it's chemo rain, but there you go.
Thank you, that's really helpful.
No, I didn't mean to imply that it was just housing,
actually, but I didn't want to go down the rabbit hole
of HS2 and back tunnels either.
Very quickly, again, the combined authority officers here
met with DEFRA to discuss the timeline for the local nature recovery strategy.
And this question of actually trying to merge our timelines, I think, is an interesting
one just to think about quickly, because we've got local authorities and their local plans
and strategies. We've got the combined authority and we've got DEFRA, and they're all marching
to a different beat, different drum. And sometimes we have to delay things or hasten things up
in order to meet these timelines. And the Combined Authority officers have been discussing
the timeline we had for the local nature recovery strategy work. And there is, it says in my
notes here, strong ministerial pressure to have the strategy in place by December 2025.
And of course, our timescale for the local nature recovery strategy are beyond this milestone.
So we've had to do what the office has called refresh the programme, and we've had to bring
in some additional help, and we've revised the timeline, it's been shared with DEFRA,
and it's now going to be for public consultation, look out for it.
is going to be four weeks between October and November 2025,
with the aim of coming to the Combined Authority
and this committee for approval and publication
in March 2026.
So just to give you a heads up,
that we're basically going to try and meet,
align with the DEFRA,
what was a good idea, align with the DEFRA requirements.
My final item on the Chair's report is a brief update on the Local Area Energy Plans, which
I keep wanting to call LEAP, but the acronym does not work.
Local Area Energy Plans.
Those of you who have been on the committee for some time will know that work has been
progressing over the last 12 months in Bradford, Kirklees, Leeds and Wakefield.
Coldadell had already done those early doors.
And it's basically a spatial representation of the interventions that are going to help move us towards net zero carbon by 2038.
And the development of a pipeline of schemes.
We have used that term again and again. We have to be ready when the newish government
is giving money to the region and to districts. We have to have a set of schemes that actually
work that have done the business planning, which will enable us to draw them down from
government and also to secure funding from other organisations and private sector investments.
So the local area energy plans, they're nearing their conclusion.
The final outputs are expected in early autumn and a paper to the next meeting of the committee in November.
And I think that will be quite significant in terms of giving us the whole of West Yorkshire local area energy plans.
It gives us a very visual, I think, geographical representation of where we are that I think will allow us to plan further.
and that's the end of my chair's report. Thank you. I'm not seeing anybody indicate. We're

7 Monitoring Indicators

going to move on to our steady item on our agendas, and that's monitoring indicators,
and there's been some interesting things. There's always, this paper comes with a health
warning, there is always a time lag in terms of the data and the data collection, so we
are looking at the past. It enables us to try and plan for the future. And a key focus
of this particular report is the latest set of local greenhouse gas emission statistics.
And Guy and Matthew are going to introduce the paper, so over to you folks.
Good afternoon, thank you, Chair.
So I'm Guy.
Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:24:14
The purpose of the report, as usual, is to present the latest data we have on the state
of the region monitoring indicators that are associated with climate, energy, and the environment,
and we'll focus on the carbon emissions on the presentation.
They were published this month by governments.
It's 2023 data, so we have to take that into account.
The paper itself also includes data related with the number of boiler,
boiled, uh, upgrade scheme, uh,
grants paid, electric consumption,
renewable energy capacity,
and EV charging infrastructure.
So I'll do the presentation on the greenhouse gas emissions,
and then I'll pass the word to my colleague Matt,
so we will, uh,
explain how our current trends, uh,
compares with the carbon emission reductions pathway.
So in 2023
greenhouse emissions, the total emissions in West Yorkshire fell by 4 .5 %
compared with the previous year and we have been in a downward trend more or less since we have data, 2005, with the exception of
2021 that we had an increase but partially because the first year of the pandemic
emissions fell
quite strongly because of restrictions.
Compared with 2019, so pre -pandemic levels,
we are 18 % below the emissions.
And our trend in general is very similar to England.
So they fell 5 % this year,
and they are 15 % below what they were in 2019.
So pre -pandemic, we declined a little bit more than England.
On a per capita basis,
We do emit less than England, 4 .1 carbon tonnes of CO2 equivalent per resident compared with
4 .8.
The major difference between West Yorkshire and England in 23 has been the same as the
previous years is that we have significantly lower emissions related with waste and agriculture.
From the gap we have, it's more or less 55 % of that difference comes from these two, which
has more to do with our urban background compared with England as an average.
In terms of local authorities, Wakefield still emits more emissions than England's average.
It's the only local authority that emits more and it's mostly explained by high emissions
on industry and transport.
So we know that our energy intensive industries in Wakefield and transport has also to do
with main roads.
We account to emissions that are not done by our residents but happen, are modelled in this area.
And there's a very important logistics hub as well.
In terms of the sources of the emissions, most of them face a decline in 2023, with industry and emissions associated with buildings falling the most.
And when we look back to 2019 domestic emissions, so the ones that we meet at home, have the
sharpest decline.
Transport is the most interesting in my opinion.
It just fell 0 .5 % last year, so it's mostly stable.
It is 15 % below what it was pre -pandemic, but we don't observe a downward trend as most
of the sectors.
as it was quite stable between 2005 and 2019 and then there's a decline with a
pandemic and then gets stable again. So it has been the most challenging one of
seeing an actual downwards trend on a permanent basis. As a consequence of that
transport related emissions now are the largest source in West Yorkshire, 36 % of
them all, while in the past domestic emissions used to be the largest
contributor and now are 27%. In terms of emissions intensity
relating with how much economic output we generate per unit of carbon, we have
been in a downward path as well but in this metric we have more emissions per
GVA generated than England but we have been converging. This has to do with our
economic structure, so more we are more towards manufacturing,
but we have been shifting to services,
and our carbon emissions have been converging
with the England's average.
And now I would pass to Matthew to interpret the data compared
with the carbon reduction.
Thank you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:28:53
Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:28:54
OK, thanks very much.
I thought I'd just quickly walk you through this graph.
Oh, sorry.
I thought I'd just quickly walk you through this graph.
Matthew Page - 0:29:02
It's a little bit more complicated than some of the others.
So the red line is the historic greenhouse gas emissions
as reported by Desnes.
And that's the data set that was published earlier this month.
I've chopped off at 2010 and squashed it up a little bit.
and that's to allow me to put in the pathways out to 2040.
Now you'll remember that there are two
carbon emission reduction pathways studies.
I've termed them SERP one and SERP two on this graph.
SERP two, the most recent one, includes a baseline,
a sort of business as usual emissions forecast,
and a pathway which gets us most of the way to net zero by 2038, and those are both shown on this graph.
The blue line is the original SERP study max ambition. You may remember that had three scenarios.
They were max ambition, high H2, and balanced. Max ambition was the most stretching of those scenarios,
and as you can see, that's very similar to the SERP2 pathway.
Okay, so what does this tell us? Broadly speaking, the most recent emissions data
that we have is in line with the both the MAPS ambition and the SERP2
pathway in terms of reductions towards a net zero by 2038. But we're relatively
early in this time series so it's very difficult to say for definite where
we're going, the next few years will I think perhaps reveal whether we're more towards
the baseline, more towards the serve -to pathway. So we await further data with interest.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:31:02
Thank you, Matthew. Questions on the officer's introductions and presentation or on the paper
as a whole.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:31:13
Thanks for the data and thanks for the update on that.
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 0:31:16
I just wonder how much is being influenced by things like, I was reading in the report
about transport and we'll come to that later, but electric vehicles and the change from
that and also the decarbonization and the intensity drop in the overall electric through
using renewables and things like that.
Do we have anything in terms of that data and how that fits with here in West Yorkshire?
Matthew?
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:31:53
Matthew Page - 0:31:55
In terms of electric vehicles, penetration of electric vehicles is still relatively modest,
so I don't think that would have made a very significant change.
But we would hope to see a reduction in transport emissions going forward because of that.
In terms of renewables, I suspect that has made a difference, certainly it has historically
with the change in power generation from fossil fuel power generation more towards renewables
and green sources of energy.
So yes, I think that has made a significant difference over the years.
Can I just pick up one or two things that are later in the paper perhaps?
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:32:31
In the paper you talk about the oil upgrade scheme and in terms of the region's uptake
being lower than the national average.
and just thinking about what's within this paper in terms of looking at the monitoring
indicators that gives us some directions for the future work of this committee.
So our upgrade scheme and our uptake being less than the national average, although more
than some other combined authorities perhaps.
The other thing that's mentioned is the generation of renewable energy, which is perhaps a bigger
subject and one for a paper for a future meeting.
Electric vehicle charging, which if one was being charitable would describe as a mess
in a muddle nationally.
but something that I think we as a committee need to think about as a combined authority.
And then the question that you touched upon, Matthew, in terms of pace and scale, the challenge
for this committee is not about the good work that's being done in some ways, but how do
we use the small public sector funds we've got to get pace and scale and roll out and
and maybe it's something we'll come to later on the agenda.
So I'm just going to, I'll give you a minute
to think about those things.
And I just wanted to bring in
cancer patient first as well.
Thank you, Chair, and you covered a little bit
Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council - 0:34:14
of what I wanted to say about EVs.
And I think the issue is the infrastructure
and the backend and the contractual arrangements,
which I know all of West Yorkshire
and the countries dealing with,
I think bottoming that out is gonna be really important
to make sure we hit national policy and legislation targets.
So let's not get forgotten about that.
But thanks for the report.
Just one thing to pick up really is it's from 2023
and I think that probably reflects one thing
that hadn't quite happened at that point,
which is about the energy demands from data centres
and the use of AI.
And now I appreciate that's what just one demand
on the electrical infrastructure,
EV infrastructure will be another one,
general energy demands rising as populations grow and change will be a thing.
But I hope that we can, I hope that we can try and, what's the best way to say it?
Have our cake and eat it. Use AI in the best way we can as an organisation and
encourage others to, but also make sure we're doing it smartly so we know that
developing images is a lot more energy intensive than it is text or developing
you know policy or where there's writing involved. So while we think about
people's jobs and not putting graphic designers and photographers out of work.
Can we also think about how we use AI smartly as an organisation that isn't
data hungry at the same time. Thank you. Right. Matthew Raghid, I know
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:35:42
you're just messengers but do you want to come back on any of those points?
Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:35:49
Great point on the data centres in the next, we want to have the specific data
But maybe on the sub industry and the locations,
we can start understanding if it is moving the dial upwards
or not, because industrial emissions have been going down.
It could be one of the ways.
On the EVs, we do underperform, but I just
want to highlight the silver lining.
On the rapid charging points, we are in line
and we are making progress, which is positive.
Polar upgrade scheme, we and most of the combined authorities
are underperforming. We looked at the places that are getting most grants. They are quite
rural and they have and it seems to be related with how energy is generated, how living systems
are. So they tend to be much more reliable on diesel. So we assume that grants are being
prioritised for those and not so much that we are not applying or something like that.
at least geographical when we look at really low level geographies suggest that.
Yeah, that's all.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:37:01
Thank you. Any other points? Gideon and then Adam.
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 0:37:07
Yeah, it's probably worth following through with that and saying that if we look at electricity
and we talk about electricity and we don't talk about overall energy,
then we might find that our energy is going up,
especially in homes in some respects,
because we've got heat pumps and we've
got other things going on that, while we'll
reduce our overall energy, are actually showing us more now.
That's not for those with batteries, by the way.
But there's dynamics in here that we
need to look at a bit more nuanced, I think,
in terms of what's happening.
In terms of EVs, I think anecdotally I would say that we have a huge amount of the EVs in this area.
We're falling over them, we get a lot of them.
And while a lot of the infrastructure seems to be a model, actually it's sorting itself out over time.
I don't know how that fits with the local authority side of it,
But I know our local authority and the infrastructure they put in is not really utilised
Thank you, I'm Adam do you want also want to introduce yourself, please
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:38:23
Adam Ashman, Advisory Representative (Yorkshire Water) - 0:38:25
Yeah, I'm Adam Ashman from Yorkshire water
Couple of questions, but just to pick up on what Gideon was saying I guess as range improves on in vehicles and the infrastructure
charging becomes
or the scale of infrastructure becomes less of an issue
because hopefully we can all use home charging,
which would be lovely.
But yeah, I had two questions.
One, in terms of the data,
it says it represents territorial emissions
and I just wondered is there any plans
for monitoring non -territorial emissions
and the trend in those or at least observing them?
And then the second one was just around
the different sectors, so I was just suspicious
of the agriculture sector line. It looks like it's been drawn with a ruler and I wondered
if, yeah, how confident are we in that data and is there anything to examine further there.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:39:20
Thank you. Thank you. Guillaume, Matthew, do you want to come back on any of those?
Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:39:26
On the territorial emissions, I don't think there are plans from government to – this
is modelled and I think it's the easiest way to add so far so things like
transport change a lot right yeah and second question was sorry agriculture
yeah it's very small the emissions that we have I think has to do where we have
a quite small sector year on the smaller these things are I think probably the
margin errors are probably larger because it is modelled maybe but yeah it's quite small
because I think it has to do with the profile of our combined authority itself.
Adam Ashman, Advisory Representative (Yorkshire Water) - 0:40:14
Just in terms of the residual emissions beyond 2040 how much of that is agriculture and is
I'm just thinking it's been flat for so long.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:40:27
Having flagged that question up, we'll take it away.
Matthew.
Just very quickly on territorial emissions, you're absolutely right.
Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:40:35
These are emissions from within West Yorkshire.
Matthew Page - 0:40:41
That's important for the transport sector where a lot of the emissions come from,
strategic road network and from interurban rail services which are to a
large extent outside our control so I think in terms of transport a lot of the
levers that you might want to pull in terms of incentivizing EV take -up and in
terms of trip making longer distance trip making are difficult for us to pull.
Guilherme Rodrigues Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:41:06
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:41:08
Okay, I'm not seeing MDL's indicate, so the committee are asked to consider the content
from the monitoring indicators. I think that's given us a basis in terms of thinking about
some of the future work and it is very important to just keep our eye on the monitoring indicators.
I know that people think the data is dull. It really isn't really it really isn't in this in this context
It is so important. So our committee happy for to note that report
Thank you
Okay, if we move on then to item eight

8 White Rose Forest - Strategic Plan Endorsement

white rose forest and we are asked to
endorse the strategic plan and
And this is a plan for 25 to 2050, in terms of the future.
This is maybe not my future, but certainly my children's and my grandchildren's future,
which is why we're here.
This has already, I think, been to all of the local authorities for discussion and consideration
there.
and Justin Wilson from Place and Environment Policy Team is going to
present the paper this afternoon. Over to you Justin. Thank you chair. So hi
Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:42:31
everyone, good afternoon. I'm Justin Wilson the Policy Manager for Environment at the
Command Authority and so I think I'm in the first half of the meeting so I'll keep
this at a brisk as well. Good. So just quickly in terms of the context
as I think you touched on at the beginning obviously politically and through the mayor
we've made and we pledge to tackle the climate and environmental emergency and
alongside supporting the white was for us programme and the command authority should be noted as a signature and
to the white was post
partnership agreements with bench embedded in the delivery of this piece of work and it does align with a lot of the
other activities certainly my team and the wider organisation are doing and the strategic plan itself it articulates and
the broad benefits of tree planting and woodland expansion and both from environmental economic and social point of view and
And some of these benefits and co -benefits, as we call them, are also drawn out in the
emerging local nature recovery strategy, which was such from the beginning of the session.
And that will set out how we can encourage tree planting to unlock nature recovery benefits,
which again are one of the parts of the wide spectrum of outputs that tree planting can
achieve.
I think just touching briefly on the overall ambition of the plan, I think it's worth noting
that West Yorkshire currently has a tree cover percentage of 14 .5 % across the
region. The plan up to 2050 as you mentioned seeks to get to 16 .5 % and
it's worth noting that there are kind of individual local authority ambitions to
sometimes go above that so if all that's met in cumulative we could get to 18 .5 %
as a kind of stretching target but it's worth saying that the 16 .5 % target by
2050 does meet from a local perspective the requirements of the environment act
2021 which sets a similar target for England. So I think that's the broad essence of the plan.
So I'll take the report as read. I think just to touch on a couple of next steps.
So as you mentioned, I think it's been through all the West Yorkshire local authorities now
and does have to go through North Yorkshire and their authorities as well. And the plan is once
that's all completed, there'll be a formal launch of the plan later on this year. I think it was
pencilled in for August, but I think there's some more comments coming out of that shortly.
And then again just touching on something you mentioned at the beginning. It's a 25 year strategy. It's quite long
It's still about that high level resolution. The plan is within that to have a series of five -year action plans
so at the end of the existing one, which is
Finishing this year and that's an understanding the white rose forest plan team are refreshing that to it from a 2025
2030 plan that which will give a bit more detail and a bit more focus on where and
Those immediate delivery steps are going to take place
So that's probably everything, Chair.
I'm happy to take any questions on that one.
Thank you, Justin.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:45:13
That was very brisk.
Can I just say, I enjoyed tremendously,
some of you will have seen embedded
in the papers the video about the tree planting on the five
acres at the Camp Hill School brought a little tear
to my eye, because in some ways that gave added value
in terms of the children with disabilities and learning
difficulties at that school, learning skills and getting to hear what the young people
themselves said about being out in nature. That was just lovely actually. But I did have
a question really and it's topical because the other case study was Morrison Moore on
the planting there and there was a reference to firebreaks and I thought how does planting
trees help reduce fire? I don't know if there's anybody on the committee who was said exactly
that within the report and within the case study. Given what's happened at Marsden Moor
with irresponsible people setting light to the Moors with barbecues and so on, and we
really need firebreaks, do we want to be planting more trees if they immediately get burned
don't know but how does planting trees help fire breaks can MD help me on that
I'm happy to take it away a broad bit of science in my head but I don't want to
Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:46:41
guess so I'll clarify that and come back to your chair thank you that's that's a
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:46:44
mystery to be solved um questions comments cancer patient thank you and
Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council - 0:46:54
thank you chair and as he said I imagine this has gone through all of our local
authorities for endorsement already.
Just picking out a little bit on there, if I can, Justin,
is just where it says it ramps up.
So it says that 1 ,500 or thereabouts
hectares have already been planted.
And then it says that in, what years is it,
23, 24 alone was 802.
So does that mean that ramp up and scale is re -achievable year
on year, do you think?
Or was that an anomaly?
Was that just about maturity of the organisation?
Any just bits to pick out on there may may well help me file if there's any further comments
Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:47:38
Thank You councillor and I think it's fair to say that delivery trajectory is quite lumpy for this and it's taken a lot of work
I think kind of historically to get the governance and the kind of working relationships with partners is quite a broad partnership and
Ranging from kind of large landowners to smaller community groups as well
I think equally the priorities between each authority of local area of change as well
so that within that there's a dynamic between
Larger landscape scale tree planting and urbanised and delivery as well. So that's made it quite difficult
I think that the feeling now within the centre means I've been attending with the partnership is that
With the the the kind of the foundations are right now to start accelerating
in delivery and that kind of ramping up terminology
is something they use quite often in terms of
being able to kind of slingshot into more delivery
now at scale.
But yeah, I think beyond that,
I think that's where I'd probably leave it.
Thank you, and it's really good to see
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:48:32
Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:48:33
some little bits of what has been going on
including the video and stuff.
I guess what I'd appeal for a little bit more,
what would probably be helpful for us
Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council - 0:48:40
just to inject a little bit of,
hesitate to say competitiveness into the process,
but innovation, let's call it instead,
is clearly each LA is starting this in a different way.
It says urban tree planting has been focused
in some areas, Clough Woodlands and others.
You know, landscapes for waters by Yorkshire,
water's been done to effect in places
where moorland's more prevalent, et cetera.
It'd be great to see case studies more writ large,
so for places like Collardale that's probably done
more of that landscape work,
what does good urban tree planting look like?
Where have you applied that?
Has that been done at the same time
things like suds are just a helpful little you know case study on a page or
two I think could be a really good bit of an additional help for us thank you
Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:49:30
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:49:30
I think it's a very good suggestion I was in London last week and certainly
there's a lot of focus on urban tree planting in terms of shade in the
current current climate okay so be interesting to see what we're doing in
in relation to that.
Any questions?
Justin really loves the aspirational nature of this document and the vision behind it.
It also made me very intrigued about a number of things that have created some questions for you, I'm afraid.
Fatima Khan-Shah (Inclusivity Champion) - 0:49:57
The first one is, it's really pleasing to see how many people you've engaged with.
I suppose the bit that I'm particularly interested in to ensure that the people that don't normally benefit from these kind of environments
in terms of thinking and contributing to the work is
when you are talking about the people you have
engaged, who are they in regards to demographics and
are we speaking to people we wouldn't normally speak
to about this subject matter. It would be really
helpful to get a bit more detail in that space.
The other bit was I wonder whether we are missing
an opportunity about connecting the importance of
the environment and mental health. Obviously I am
shared with the health and care partnership and we
I think it's important to know that green spaces,
particularly during COVID, has a massive impact on
people's health and wellbeing as well as other health benefits.
Are we making that link as strong as we could be? I'm not
sure.
And then the final bit is how do we know we're getting to a place
where the people that are not on board on this agenda are
absolutely ambassadors for it and are getting the benefits.
It would be really helpful to understand how we know we're getting where we want to be,
the sort of metrics and bench points by which we know, and if not, how do we repivot.
Sorry if they're very big questions, but it was an aspirational document and it stimulated
my thinking. Thank you.
Thank you. Justin, you've got a few to go up there and do your best.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:51:13
Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:51:13
Thank you, Chair, and thank you, Fatima. So in terms of the engagement demographics, we're
partnerships. I'm not into the whole detail but I can certainly get that from them. I
think to give it a bit of a link across into some of the work that we are leading on in
terms of the local natural recovery strategy. So that's something that we've done a lot
of engagement on upfront and equally with the more harder to engage with community groups
as well. So we've got a piece of work going on at the moment with young people and people
that have got accessibility challenges and equally we are directly feeding that into
policy through the local nature recovery strategy.
So it's a similar space in terms of nature recovery.
And obviously tree planting is part of that.
And we're getting that loud and clear
in terms of making sure it's something that they recognise,
something that's usable for them as an end product.
And then equally, selfishly, from a delivery point of view
as well, there's a lot of good work
that community groups could do to collaboratively support us
on our objectives as an organisation,
as a group of partners as well.
And then in terms of the link between environment
and environmental mental health.
Again, I can take that away and come back to you
in terms of white rows for us, but looking at the local nature
recovery strategy linkage.
And I think we took a paper to the last committee
in terms of a broader update, but people is a strong,
it's one of the three missions within the LRS
that's in nature at the moment.
And within that, we recognised this nature connectedness
to making sure people are feeling connected to nature,
caring for it, and then making climate minded decisions
or behaviours and also reaping those benefits in terms of the mental health angle as well.
People talk about kind of green source prescribing is the big thing but it's actually just walking
into nature and experiencing it which is the more softer angle of things but it does unlock
a lot of benefits.
So we are kind of, I won't say all over it but we're certainly kind of starting to get
into the right place with it and then equally once the LNRS is published early next year
hopefully, fingers crossed, when we go into the delivery phase we'll be kind of springboarding
to do more local based projects and actually try to make that real rather than just stuff
from a strategy point of view. So I hope that answers some of your questions but I'll take
the latter points away.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:53:22
Thank you and climate justice is that underlying theme of much of what we do in the combined
authority but you'll take some of those away to the White Rose for its partnership and
put them, thank you Fatima.
We're asked, sorry, Gideon.
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 0:53:46
.
.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:55:07
Thank you, Gideon. I'm going to take Councillor Fick's question as well.
It's more of a comment than a question. I mean, it is an aspirational document.
Cllr Mohan Sokhal - 0:55:15
I think we even managed to plant close to half a million trees.
And if you look at our ambition to increase from 16 % to 33%, you know, the tree and wood
cover. Again it's very ambitious but I think the challenge is you know the more you plant
the more you know you start running out of spaces and which are suitable for planting
and that's the challenge we all face I think to an extent not just suitable but also it
has to meet you know you've got to consult residents as well and their needs as well
what people want green spaces so it is it is you know I think you need to be
ambitious chair and that's where we are and we'll see what the next 25 years
bring
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:56:12
um Justin would you like to come back just a few points and then we'll wind
Justin Wilson, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 0:56:19
this item up okay chair and in terms of these I think Gideon you came up with a
was a comment around the conflicts of land use.
So that is something, there's various levels to that.
So I've given you a few examples.
So the local area energy planning work
that we're leading on obviously has a land kind of ask
within that and equally the LNRS likewise has potentially kind
of land implications.
So from our own family documents, we're obviously trying
to join those up and align them where possible.
I think ultimately there is a level to this
where there will be some conflicts
and particularly in terms of development schemes, it'd be something that that landowner or those decision makers from a local planning authority point of view
would have to just weigh up in terms of which is the key thing that needs to happen on this piece of land or in kind of a more utopian view, but can land uses coexist?
So I know certainly from the engagement we did with the farming and agriculture sector,
where we talked about nature recovery, it was quite initially anyway,
it's like well you can't have both of them when actually you can in some scenarios
where you're looking at kind of farm fringes, areas of farmland that flood or are suitable for livestock,
you can do something a bit more of a mosaic basis, so you can get that kind of dual use there.
And equally on development sites as well, particularly on larger strategic sites,
generally from a planning point of view you'd want green space in that site
anyway from a planning requirement, well for the health and wellbeing perspective
as well so again it's kind of making that green space work in the right way
rather than just to satisfy a kind of a policy requirement or a metric in that
scenario so it's something we're working through and I think ultimately there is
that kind of management that needs to take place and I think that the other
tier is in terms of conflicts we're a kind of the business end of the mapping
process for the LNGRS at the moment and we've seen habitat by habitat
conflicts emerging through that process as well so over the next couple of weeks
that's what we're doing now we're kind of ratifying where those alignment
issues whether they can coexist whether they need to kind of divorce from each
other in some scenarios and to make sure we give them a clear message to the
public and the user base as well and then I think in terms of funding I don't
think anything's been announced in terms of the recent round of funding for from
from White Rose Forest but I think it was broadly positive certainly in the
short term. But you're right obviously politics and funding can change but I
think the big thing that's obviously on the agenda at the moment is the
biodiversity net gain side of things and equally the local nature recovery
strategy and we've seen that potentially being a bit of an accelerant in terms of
tree planting and again kind of trying to facilitate the right tree in the
right place through that type of work as well. So I think the die will change a
bit, maybe less Defra Core funding, more BNG, but it's about kind of looking at what that
cocktail fund is going to be in the future and just modelling it and mapping it. And
again, that's why the White House Forest Partnership team are doing those five year action plans,
which will take those very more detailed granular snapshots of how that's going to happen on
the ground at those particular intervals. And I think that was all the comments.
Thank you. Thank you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 0:59:31
I'm really pleased about the five -year slices in terms of that 25 -year plan and that gives
us something very concrete to, or not concrete rather, to hold on to.
The committee's asked to note and endorse the white rose for a strategic plan.
Content?
Thank you very much.
We'll move on then to item nine.

9 Home Energy West Yorkshire - Skills & Supply Chain Update

This committee does range over a lot of different things, doesn't it?
Home Energy, West Yorkshire, Skills and Supply Chain update.
And Michelle is going to give us an update on this particular piece of work.
Thank you.
Thank you, Chair.
Thanks.
So I'm Michelle Hunter.
I'm the Policy and Partnerships Lead in Skills for Business in the Employment and Skills
team.
Michelle Hunter, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:00:21
and this paper was developed in collaboration with colleagues from the Home Energy West
Shorks team. The purpose of the paper was just to provide an update on the progress
regarding retrofit skills, supply chain and the alignment to broader skills interventions
within the construction sector. Specifically it highlights emerging opportunities and challenges
but also the proposed approach to addressing some of these skills strategies in order to
meet the region's net zero ambitions. A few points to highlight from the paper
we know the importance of retrofitting homes is key to achieving net zero
targets and installing that key to that is installing heat pumps and expanding
solar capacity. We know that these actions will significantly reduce
emissions in the region and skills is a key enabler in order to do this. Just in
terms of skills and workforce challenges you'll see from the paper that we've
highlighted the regional challenges in particular around skill shortages in the construction and retrofit sectors and
significantly around an ageing workforce gaps in provision
tutor shortages and uncertainty around
Pathways career pathways, but also guarantees of work
We're addressing this at the moment through some of our existing levers in skills. For example working collaboratively with our local
skills improvement partnership and also utilising our evolved adult skills funding to influence
and create that systematic change that is needed. In the paper we have talked about
some of the interventions that are currently taking place, those include boot camps, utilising
our apprenticeship levy interventions that inspire young people and create those pipelines
for green jobs that build on the mayor's green jobs task force. Alongside this, recent government
announcements have highlighted construction as a national priority. On a local level we're
improving our existing provision particularly around level two and three courses. This will
hopefully enable us to tackle those skills shortages and get people back into the workforce.
You'll see in the paper that we've highlighted we have many assets in our region around
construction but we also have some deep -rooted challenges and complex
challenges in this sector as well. So in terms of a recommendation the paper
outlined a proposal to align retrofit skills to the work that's been
undertaken by the CA to develop cluster action plans. These are aligned to our
local growth plan and for skills these will act as a live document to inform
provision and future needs and help us to commission effectively in the region.
In order to address those skills challenges linked to retrofit and other transformational
programmes, we are proposing that we develop a specific construction skills action plan
that allows us to address the skills needed for retrofit and other transformational projects.
We would be really keen to share this plan with this committee and also our economy committee
as well.
So I will pause there, thank you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:03:34
Thank you, Michelle. Questions, comments? Martin.
Thanks, Chair, thanks, Michelle. Martin Broadus from West Yorkshire Housing Partnership.
Martyn Broadest, Advisory Representative (West Yorks Housing Partnership) - 1:03:45
Both in terms of our net zero plans and in terms of the government's ambition to build a 1 .5 million homes and generally drive a very big growth agenda,
construction skills are an absolute massive probably the biggest single
issue that we face so I can't understate really what this is important how
important this is. From my own perspective in terms of retrofit work
Most of the skills that are needed are actually core skills.
So, and obviously those are transferrable then into other types of construction activity.
So I'm not quite sure to what benefit, certainly at a trade level, badging things as retrofit specialisms.
I'm not sure how helpful that is.
The people that are fitting insulation and other products and heat pumps and so on, they're first and foremost plasterers and joiners and plumbers that have developed additional skills.
And indeed for heat pump engineers, I will only specify a heat pump if it's got the endorsement of the manufacturer.
The manufacturers will only give the endorsement
if the fitter has been on one of their own training courses.
So training people as generic heat pump engineers
might sound great, but there might be some sort of supply
chain challenges that get thrown into that.
So yeah, I think the overall thing, I can't, yeah,
as I said, again, I can't understate
the importance of this agenda.
I think there are possibly some nuances which
that could maybe feed into the broader growth and the broader house building,
other priorities that we have to try and meet.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:05:50
Thank you. I think there are huge supply chain challenges with construction generally,
as well as retrofit, as you rightly say, Gideon.
Thanks for this. I echo Martin's view on this as well.
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 1:06:04
There's been a number of times where we've had organisations trying to set up specialist retrofit training organisations.
Certainly in Kirkleaves we had one a few years ago and they fell by the wayside, they couldn't get traction.
So now seems like a good time to really start talking to them about this.
I think there's one important thing to think about in terms of retrofit and that is that
we are in danger if we're not training people properly and if we don't get the right materials
in place to create more problems with mould and other things as well and get the right
ventilation or the right products in place.
and we note that the Government's Great British Insulation Scheme is not offering the right products for particularly hard to treat stone housing like we have here.
So we need to be very careful with what's being offered and the knowledge that people need to actually take the right products on board.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:07:22
Thank you. I'm sure Michelle is going to take those comments away. I would absolutely endorse
certainly in Calderdale the number of older stone properties we have and where we need
skills around natural building materials and things like lime plaster. Plastering is plastering,
of course. But nonetheless, there are nuances to this. I think we can all agree there's
a tremendous skills challenge and that we actually really need to use what we've got
here in the combined authority in terms of the other committees, the employment and skills
committee, the work that we do around adult retraining, apprenticeships, young people.
Let's see if we can join those things together. But I think perhaps you're hearing from this
particular committee that there are some further things to think about which I
think are opportunities actually in terms of branding and marketing and
bringing people on as well as challenges more generally. Fatima. I completely agree
chair I mean there's something about the knitting of this to other specific work
programmes that I think we're not maximising the opportunities on but I
think it's a really well thought through paper Michelle and the point I was
Fatima Khan-Shah (Inclusivity Champion) - 1:08:37
to make was obviously with the healthier working lives sort of targeted approach, there's an
opportunity for us to really address that skills gap and actually make some targeted
interventions to individuals from cohorts of society who are really looking for an opportunity
to go into this space but not quite sure how to do so. I also wonder whether we could maximise
some of the women across Yorkshire networks in this space as well and really advocate
the fact that this is a sector that women can be represented in and support as well,
which I think would be a great thing that I can help with.
I suppose my reflection is though,
as a woman who wants to fix all the problems in the world,
we can't fix everything.
So is there a way in which, particularly
when we're thinking about the implications
for inclusive growth or the E &D implications,
is there a prioritisation that we might need to think about?
And also going back to Councillor Raffit's comments
about smart metrics, is there a way
in which we can again get some clarity about how
we know we're getting there with the people that need it
the most. I just wonder whether we've got such a solid foundation and this is such great
work but we could really build on it to make it truly impactful for the communities of
West Yorkshire.
Thank you. Michel, sorry, Councillor Rafiq.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:09:50
Cllr Mohan Sokhal - 1:09:54
Yeah, just on that, I mean I think it's a very, like you said, chair, it's a very challenging
sector with a huge shortage and there are there are particularly when it comes
to retrofits that the actual levels have actually changed you know it's a lot
more harder and if you if you look at the current market there are only a
handful of contractors or organisations who actually could actually do that
other than aren't trained or qualified to do it so perhaps I think we need to do
some work with the educational institutions, including schools, and encourage more apprenticeships
across the board. I think that's the way forward. I remember a few years, well, several years
back, there was an acute shortage of, for instance, gas engineers and electricians,
and I think somewhat we kind of overcome that in recent 10, 15, 20 years, and there's no
reason why we can't overcome this problem but given obviously the need to
move forward we need to obviously the faster we actually train more people
particularly young people into apprenticeships and in fact that's quite
right you know including women and people from diverse backgrounds as well.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:11:14
There's a real opportunity there for some stock -up businesses I can
definitely definitely see it. Michelle is there anything you want to any last
the word you want to come back on before we wind up?
Yeah, thank you.
I think those are really helpful comments and really great
opportunity to align to the work and health and healthy work
in life agenda.
And also Martin's point around mixed success
with what we've had already around attracting people
Michelle Hunter, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:11:37
into those specific retrofit courses.
I think we'd like to take a more broad approach to this,
ensuring that we reach and align to the work that's happening
already across the region.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:11:51
Thank you very much. Thank you. Last word to Council patient. Thank you, thank you
Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council - 1:11:57
Chair. Yeah just to add to that and to some of the comments that have been
picked up I think I think they're really well rehearsed and right. I think there's
a thing here about and I'm sure it's in the details somewhere about making sure
we capture young people while they're still in the Eyes Wide Open scope so it's
great to go into HE and FE and pull people out of existing workplaces but I think the
sweet spot having ushered three through the school system is getting them at that kind
of you know when they're in what I would have called back in the day year for high school
it's called it's a higher number than that now and thinking about making this I hesitate
to say like sexy but making this seem more appealing where media and those kind of things
that will always seem like exciting jobs on our right
and people should be going into those industries.
But just a little bit.
Maybe street cred rather than sexy.
Thank you very much, that's much better
and I stand corrected, sit corrected even.
So yeah, just about capturing them at that point
to make sure that these plethora of jobs
that are gonna be really integral
are caught at the right point and not missed.
And I think there's something about,
I'm gonna resist the temptation to look back
to Great Manchester and think about the GM back and what they are doing but if a similar
product in terms of how we want to engage our young people could be brought in I think
that would be massive. Thank you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:13:26
Interesting I'm going to draw that item to close Michelle I'm sure we could go on but
thank you very much for that. The committee are asked to note the current progress and
Michelle if you could take the points that were made particularly around the question
of the metrics and the need to engage people
at an early stage I think would be very helpful, thank you.
Okay, moving on then to item 10.

10 Home Energy West Yorkshire Evaluation Update

We've done 10 items so far committee, we're doing well.
If we can move on to the home energy
West Yorkshire evaluation update
and what's in front of you is an overview
of the progress that has been made on the domestic net zero evaluation programme. We
know, we have learned that there is no point in doing the work that we are doing without
evaluating it. That is the point of this paper in terms of an overview of the progress of
the evaluation. Mia is going to take us through this paper. Over to you, Mia.
Mia Higgins - 1:14:32
I am here in the home energy West Yorkshire team and I am leading on our evaluation.
The aim of this paper is to bring an update to the committee and note the progress around
the evaluation.
We kicked this off in autumn of last year and it will be running all the way through
to spring of 2027 and it covers all the Home Energy West
Yorkshire projects that fall within that time frame.
And the goal was to bring them under a single evaluator
to kind of promote efficiencies, reduce the costs,
and provide a comprehensive overview,
as well as being able to link up the different sort of projects
and provide that overall programme evaluation as well,
which we're hoping to complete towards the end
of this time frame.
So we will then hoping to use that information to inform our future projects, take learnings from what we've done, inform our home energy West Yorkshire plan as well, and ultimately support our objectives of ensuring that everyone in West Yorkshire can live in a kind of warm, comfortable, low carbon home.
So there have been like a couple that have fallen out of scope of this time frame just because the time frame is contracted to that
spring
2027 date and unfortunately a few schemes have been delayed
So the area based schemes of Wakefield and Kirklees along with the supply chain
Project as well have fallen out of scope. So they will naturally still see evaluations, but it won't come under this sort of overall
evaluation
and we're hoping to then use actually that additional resource to kind of support a more in -depth evaluation for the
Area based schemes that remain and also potentially different projects as we go along and we see where we might actually want to explore
a bit further than we'd initially planned
so at the moment we've
completed the social housing decarbonization fund wave
2 .1 evaluation and the local energy area demonstrator evaluation as well
We also have the residential collective buy -in scheme evaluation, which we're hoping to finalise in the next couple of weeks.
So we had some kind of key findings come back from them. So in relation to the social housing decarbonisation fund
We had some data that you can see in the report, so I won't go through it all but we did have some feedback around
What might be useful for us to take forward so some considerations around?
improving our stock data, getting better knowledge
of our properties, what kind of condition they're in,
really would help us to better kind of inform
our projects ahead of time.
Knowledge sharing as well between providers
was identified as a really sort of crucial point
that sort of helps the progress of the project.
Also the targeting to ensure substantial EPC impacts
as well and the importance of resident engagement
really came out and creating that positive kind of feeling
and within communities, as well as the need
for the supply chain to be further developed.
So we're hoping that this evaluation can support
the sort of future work under warm homes
and also the HUE plan,
the Home Energy West Shortship plan as well.
So in terms of the local energy area demonstrator,
the aim of that was to better understand
how to reach communities and provide them
with energy saving and retrofit advice
to encourage the uptake of retrofit measures.
It generally targeted three main groups.
So it targeted older people who were facing deprivation,
older people who were also able to pay,
and individuals with low or no proficiency in English.
And it was found to be fairly effective
at engaging these communities.
And it really demonstrated the importance
of building trust in those local relationships
and really simple and kind of clear communication
with residents as well as having that kind of sustained
and long -term relationships that residents could rely on.
So we're hoping to use the kind of outcomes
from that evaluation to inform the one -stop shop
and also the Home Energy West Yorkshire plan as well.
Finally, the residential collective buying scheme.
This was aimed at able -to -pay residents,
so it looked to basically, through collective buying,
aim to make solar more affordable,
And it covered both solar and battery storage so you could have either both together or separately
Generally, we found there was a very strong satisfaction
When we did this evaluation the residents sort of outlined their goals overall were to reduce energy bills and also to access
solar at a cheaper rate
There was some really positive feedback as well around residents saying that the combined authority backing gave them confidence
It gave the scheme credibility and they felt that they were going to be able to sort of trust the quality of the product
And we also had some really interesting statistics which are in the paper around
46 % said they wouldn't have explored solar otherwise and 58 % of those who were looking into solar
They said they would have only installed it at least a year into the future. So there are some really positive feedback there as well
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:19:45
Thank you very much Mia. I'm just going to pause for a moment and just see if MD wants
to perhaps have a declaration of interest if MD has been involved in any of these schemes.
Martin, thank you.
Martyn Broadest, Advisory Representative (West Yorks Housing Partnership) - 1:20:11
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:20:17
Thank you, Councillor. Any questions or comments?
Fatima. And then Councillor O 'Feeke.
Thank you, Mia. This is the first time I've seen the report, so if I ask a stupid question,
Fatima Khan-Shah (Inclusivity Champion) - 1:20:32
I apologise in advance, but I've learnt to never assume anything in my line of work.
I just wanted to ask for a bit more information regarding some of the demographics as part
of the evaluation, because one of the bits of assurance I'm really keen to understand
is the people that are the most marginalised or seldom heard individuals are actually a
part of the evaluation. So there are some elements in the report where you've broken
down older people, which is great, and deprivation, but there's also sort of other elements, people
with disabilities for example, other areas that I'd be really, really interested in.
And then the other bit that really drew my attention was the section 7 where it talked
a little bit about the EDI implications and I was just really surprised that
there weren't any at all and just some assurance that we're not missing
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:21:20
anything but thank you. Mia. Thank you for those comments. So when we undertook
the evaluations part of what we were looking at was the data that was being
collected and something we've kind of identified is that across the different
projects that is really varied so some projects we might collect a lot more
Mia Higgins - 1:21:36
data on factors such as that and some we might collect a lot less and I think
what was also quite evident is one such as the residential collective buying
scheme is aimed at able to pay residents so if we are looking at models like that
there's almost a limiting factor there in the fact that it is aimed at those
and perhaps that's something what we're looking at considering as part of our
home energy West Yorkshire plan is how do we have more consistent data
collection why are we collecting that data what's the purpose of it and also
what are the projects ultimately trying to achieve.
So there may be ones such as the residential
collective buying scheme that tend to focus
a lot more on moving us on this sort of climate aspect,
reducing emissions, things such as that,
and there may be others with other targets more specifically
so I think that's something that's come out
of the evaluations overall is that consistency of data
is something that we really are going to kind of
need to look at moving forwards as well as the objectives
that the projects hope to achieve.
We did have under the local energy area demonstrator scheme,
it was specifically targeted at those groups.
So when we did do that sort of feedback,
we did the interviews as part of that evaluation,
we did look to get a kind of representative sample
across those groups to really understand
how they were impacted and get specific feedbacks,
feedback as well on how they interacted with the project
and what barriers maybe they faced,
and we're hoping to take that all forward in our learnings.
So there's a lot more sort of broken down
in the reports and stuff in that detail.
Also, when we carry out the kind of case study interviews
as well, we try and make sure that we get a range of people
in terms of how they've engaged with the scheme,
whether they've come forward or not,
but also making sure that we try and get a representation
across the whole of West Yorkshire as much as possible.
Some schemes might be more,
we might have had more recipients in certain areas,
and also to try and reflect
as sort of diverse a range as possible.
So we do consider those, but yeah,
ultimately that has been something
that has come back to us,
is that there's a bit of inconsistency across the projects,
and a lot of them have sort of predetermined set goals,
so we might not be collecting certain information,
and where is it necessary to collect that as well,
because if we are collecting personal information,
we naturally have to have a justification
for collecting that, so also looking into
that if we are going to collect that, how do we have a sort of justified reasoning for
doing so.
Thank you. That's a good explanation of the learning so far already. Thank you for that.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:24:08
I've got Councillor Feke and then Neil.
Thank you, Chair.
And then Martin.
Cllr Mohan Sokhal - 1:24:16
Thank you. Mine's regarding 3 .16, which is the residential collective buying scheme.
I think the report talks about collecting buying scheme for batteries in Habsaw line
relaunching, I think we need to work closely with various local authorities in order to
amplify communication and a wider take up on that.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:24:42
Thank you. I'm going to take Neil and Martin and then ask somebody, Liz or me, depending
on whether it's about the data collection and evaluation or the actual schemes themselves.
So, first of all, Neil.
Thank you, Chair.
Mr Neil Whalley, Advisory Representative (Northern Gas Networks) - 1:24:56
Just a question about the collective buying scheme.
Are there cheques and balances in place with regard to the ethical supply chains for the
solar products that are available by that, because it does draw a lot of attention in
particular in the media?
Indeed.
Okay.
Thank you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:25:17
I'm going to come to Martin and then I'm perhaps going to ask Liz to pick up some of those
points.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Martyn Broadest, Advisory Representative (West Yorks Housing Partnership) - 1:25:25
It would be, I'm sure other partners in the West York Transit Partnership would be very
keen to see the results of the evaluation of wave 2 .1 if that's possible to share.
I suspect I know the answer to this because the timescale for the evaluation was relatively
short but is there any plans to do a sort of a more longitudinal evaluation of the impact
of some of the retrofit measures for residents and in particular I'm thinking around health
and wellbeing. As is highlighted in the report, take -up of retrofit programmes is a real barrier
to delivering our net zero ambitions, getting people interested in it. Retrofit is not a
street cred word. I firmly believe that pushing the health and wellbeing benefits of that
investment is going to be a far better sell to our customers, our residents, than any
sort of net zero or energy efficiency or other ethereal arguments. So the more evidence that's
available to support that would help considerably, I think.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:26:41
Thank you, Martin. Well, I'm going to come to Liz or Jess in terms of I've got ethics,
ethical questions, ethical supply chain questions. I've got a question about sharing data. I've
got questions about improving take -up. And I've got a question about health and wellbeing.
Yes?
Thank you, Chair. Good afternoon, everyone. My name is Jess McNeil. I'm head of Home Energy
U .S. structure at the Combined Authority. So, Neil, just coming onto your point around
Jessica McNeil West Yorkshire Combined Authority - 1:27:09
ethical supply. Yes, any installer that we work with, whether directly through the residential
collective buying scheme or other support that we provide for West Shorkshire Housing
Partnership works. All installers have to comply with the Modern Slavery Act and we
ensure that they have done that through robust due diligence, they have to apply their annual
statements so it's obviously a tricky position that it's difficult to get away from but we
do ensure that those ethical cheques and balances are done for all of our installers before
we do engage with them. Just coming back to Martin's point about health and wellbeing,
You'll see in the workshop that we're going to go into after the formal meeting around some of the language that we're looking to change to engage residents, because you're absolutely right.
There's a different reason for people getting involved. Climate and the environment sometimes isn't what people want to engage with, so how do we broaden that message around the benefits, the health, the wellbeing, the reduction in bills.
It's quite broad so hopefully you'll see in the workshop how we're looking to try and
change our language to engage as many residents as we can to be actively involved in retrofit.
And apologies chair, I didn't quite catch the question on data collection.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:28:24
Are we going to be sharing, given this evaluation, sorry, given this evaluation is a useful set
of information and it helps us to address some of the questions about what works, what
doesn't, how do we accelerate pace, how do we scale things up, are we going to be sharing
some of the data that we've collected?
Jessica McNeil West Yorkshire Combined Authority - 1:28:43
Yes, we will have exact summaries of the evaluations that we've concluded, they just weren't quite
ready for this meeting this afternoon, but when we have a more comprehensive set of reports
that will be informative to committee, we'll certainly bring that at a future meeting.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:29:01
and can I just remind you about cancer of Feekes point about take up improving
Liz Hunter, Director (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:29:10
take up and thanks I'll take that one because what was if we kind of cast our
minds back to when we launched the collective buying scheme it was
interwoven let's say with various general elections and other things which
meant that and I think we need sometimes we're doing evaluation you need to look
at the context within which sometimes things are launched and we would
probably do things differently and we would certainly welcome greater and we'll look at
this comms through our local authority partners and then we probably did last time so yeah
thank you that's a great offer and we'll take it up.
Thank you.
Gideon.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:29:43
Yeah thanks for that.
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 1:29:47
I just wondered in terms of the broader thing how we're looking at this in terms of carbon
and our carbon budgets and how that's going to fit in to give us an idea of what the impact
that would be if we were to roll it out over the period and what that would give us in
a benefit and if there's any work going to be going on on that. Thanks.
Mia, you've told us about your cont work and your col work in terms of some of the future
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:30:14
scenario projections. Is there any planned work on that?
Mia Higgins - 1:30:25
So the residential collective buying scheme was one where we did measure that kind of
carbon coming back.
I think one of the key things having looked across these evaluations is again the consistency
of data.
So the methodology that's used in order to do that, obviously it's somewhat predictive
as well.
We can't be wholly sure.
So the consistency of how do we measure that across different schemes as well and particularly
the things such as smaller measures, it might be that collective buy -in is an easier way
for us to actually measure that if we are focusing on one technology.
So this one was a pilot scheme, but there were actually, in some of the feedbacks, sort
of suggestions from residents, maybe we could roll this out with other technologies or we
could roll out future iterations of this.
So I think for ones like that, the data capture, we do have the kind of carbon -saving estimates
sort of within that report and that's something that we could look to reflect but I think
more broadly across all of the different projects that we deliver there's perhaps sort of different
challenges in how we collect that data and the consistency of it across the whole programme.
Thank you Mia. I'm going to allow Gideon to come back and I'm going to allow Councillor
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:31:34
Rafik to come back because I'm a sucker for all these questions you've got in that discussion
and then I'm going to draw this to a close. Gideon.
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 1:31:51
Mine actually isn't a question for you, it's an awareness thing. In Kirklees we have something called Energy Neighbours, sorry I have to get the right one going, which is a three year project looking at how we communicate and how people get on board with energy.
I can put you in touch with the people big lottery funded project
Might be worth all of us having a chat
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:32:21
Cllr Mohan Sokhal - 1:32:23
Council Rafique just a short one, please. It's a short one. Actually just on the one -stop scheme
There's not seem to be any details. It may be that it's been covered in previous when I wasn't here
but it is key to
particularly when it comes to retrofit for all tenures.
Ms.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:32:44
If you can hold your suspense we will be covering that in the workshop.
Liz Hunter, Director (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:32:46
We have definitely got some plans to come forward.
So yeah, thank you.
Right, Committee are asked to note the progress of the evaluation programme
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:32:56
and more power to your elbow, Mia.
We really need this work to be done. Thank you very much.

11 The Mayor's West Yorkshire Local Transport Plan (LTP) - Statutory Consultation 2025

Okay, we're moving on to the last two transport related items and I want to welcome Helen
Illerton who has actually been sitting through the whole committee to do these last items
and you're very welcome Helen and I hope the discussion and contributions have been edifying
so far and just by way of introduction for those people who are new to the committee.
We spent some time at, I think it was committee before last, talking about the fact that transport
are the biggest carbon emitters in the region and the way in which there are big plans in
terms of franchising carbon reduction in the transport sector within West Yorkshire and
how we might, within this committee, first of all gain a better understanding in terms
of what's happening, what are the stages and sequencing of what's happening and how can
we add value to that process. And also, without being scrutiny, you know, ask the questions
and interrogate what's happening in terms of making sure that we're joined up as a combined
authority in terms of working forward. So what we've got in front of us is a short paper
which first of all introduces a statutory consultation
on the new Mayors West Yorkshire local transport plan.
And there were then going on to a second paper, which
is about bus franchising.
And one of the things I must say about the local transport
plan, obviously the Department for Transport
has a transport plan.
There are regional transport plans,
and then there are hyper local transport plans in the district and they all use particular
language and they have their own particular set of abbreviations and Helen is going to
unfold this world for us and tell us how it all works. Over to you Helen.
Thank you and thank you very much. It's been really interesting being here for the filming
Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:35:22
because as you say around transports interaction across the whole agenda.
Hello everybody, I'm Helen Elton, I'm head of transport policy at the
Combine Authority and as council school is here with a paper around the local
transport plan so I think a bit of a kind of background kind of as to what it
is and where we are and where we're going next. So we are in the process of
developing a new local transport plan for West Yorkshire.
This is a region -wide, so across all of West Yorkshire,
this is a region -wide statutory document
that applies and sets out the policy framework
for how we deliver transport across the piece.
As Councillor Scullion has just said,
obviously the districts are the component
highway authorities and bring forward
their own kind of delivery and proposals about how they want to roll out and build on what
we say. The statutory framework that we put forward through this local transport plan
guides that future delivery. The reason we're coming today, and I'll set
out the detail behind it in a moment, is we are due to start our statutory consultation,
which is our 12 week consultation on the overall policy framework on the 29th of July for 12
weeks. So that's a week to date and we'll be out to consultation for 12 weeks.
This builds on the engagement that we undertook last year around the vision and objectives
and we had a really good eight week period last year where we were talking to communities,
talking to committees and talking to a lot of people, statutory stakeholders as well
and had some really good feedback that we have since fed into and it's really helped
us structure the policy framework that we are now coming back to consult on formally.
A new local transport plan is needed because our current local transport plan was adopted
in 2017 and a lot has changed since then, not least the fact that we have a new mayor
who has new powers and has accelerated and therefore changed how we deliver and our focus
on delivery. But also we've had COVID and the impact of that has had on travel patterns
and just how we operate as a region has significant impact. And also to add to that changing governments
and changing focus around funding and how we are,
devolution, et cetera, et cetera,
all means that we need to think about
how we do our policy framework locally.
So the local transport plan that's to be consulted on
presents a new policy framework that's being developed
alongside a number of key transport programmes.
And I think this is an important part
around the context for the policy framework.
So we are already in a programme to develop a mass transit system for which phase one
was engaged on and route options were engaged on last summer alongside the vision and objectives
for the local transport plan and further consultation on a preferred route will be consulted on
next year.
We are also in a programme for delivering bus franchising and due to have all services across
West Yorkshire on contracts to us by within 2028. So those two are two significant kind
of strategic priorities that mean our policy framework needs to enable delivery. We have
also started to embark upon a structure along with Great British Rail around a programme
for rail reform and how that therefore then looks at how we want to be involved and manage
and oversee what happens on our rail network.
And lastly, we have launched a new transport brand,
the Weaver brand.
Now, the Weaver brand is a public -facing way
of defining our transport network,
but it is critical to how we view our policy framework,
but how we also view our public transport network,
and then our transport network overall.
So I think it's fair to say this local transport plan
presents a good opportunity to build on these strategic priorities and set out a policy
framework that will enable delivery but it is also making sure that we can bring those
things together in a way that is understandable for the public and understandable for us all
to engage with practically. So the vision that is set out in the paper but also built
upon as the basis for the local transport plan is to create the Weaver network as a
the local transport plan takes on board, it is built on four objectives and built on how
it will support and help deliver our local growth plan, our West Yorkshire plan and sits
alongside the climate environment plan as well and the future spatial development strategy.
So it's basically looking at how we can make sure the policy framework that is statutory
for transport helps to deliver some of the outcomes as part of the wider policy offer
from the Commonwealth authority.
And from kind of specifically from this committee's perspective, transport is a significant contributor
to carbon and particulate emissions, for example.
So kind of putting in place and how that links to kind of the four objectives, making sure
we can build in policies and frameworks and delivery from both the capital infrastructure
but also wider behaviour change to increase use of the Weaver network to reduce emissions
across tailpipe but also across wider polluting modes is really important.
So in order to present the new local transport plan for adoption next year, it's important
we hear from as many people as possible across all kind of all society in terms of the public
but also stakeholders as well and other interested parties.
Thank you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:41:56
Thank you, Helen. There's a lot there and there's a lot in the paperwork. Any early
comments? Go on, John.
I'm John Clark, I'm a private representative but I also work for a company called Cummins,
John Clark (Private Sector Representative) - 1:42:27
so we make diesel engines so I probably should declare an interest at the same time, right,
in terms of these pieces.
Interest particularly when looking at the report and on the bus franchising piece, what
was quite surprising to me was actually seeing the number of vehicles that were Euro for
earlier, that was still in the fleet. Because if you go to a Euro 6 diesel specification,
you will reduce NOx numbers by 90 % and particulate matter by 50 % and fuel economy by 10 to 15%.
So it's a big change in terms of reduction. The other piece was there was no mention about
the Bradford hydrogen facility that's been set up and how will that be used to power
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:43:25
busses in the future. Thank you. And of course we're also touching
on the next report in terms of the franchising, bus franchising. Over to you Helen to deal
with those questions. And I have to say this question of Euro 4 busses and so on is one
that exercises this particularly outside Leeds and Bradford actually in terms of the age
of some of the stock that we've got access to at the moment.
Thank you. And some really valid points in that. So Alex Clark, if you don't know if
Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:43:58
you want to just come around, Alex, because you're kind of crossing over onto the next
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:44:01
onto the next paper around franchising, but the
Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:44:07
fleet, the bus fleet that you're specifically referring to is something that we've been for a number of years working with operators to
improve and
improve the emissions if you like, reduce, like increase the euro standard if you like to make that a better offer across West Yorkshire.
And we have done, we have been successful
with
albeit in certain regions, but we have been successful with
the
department for transport funding to bring in zero emission busses
across, for example, Leeds and Bradford have benefited through
a number of depots. As part of franchising, our intention and
our aim is to bring zero emission vehicles across our
fleets.
I do wonder, committee, because I think we're probably going to, as John has just done,
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:45:00
we're probably going to stray between here's our local transport plan, which we've got
to put in to the Department for Transport as the overarching strategic document, and
nestling within that is the bus franchising, the important locally bus franchising scheme.
I wonder if perhaps we should hear from Alex in terms of introduction to the bus franchising paper and
Then take questions around because I know that some people have been waiting to ask questions
But whether we could take those together, how does that sound?
Alex Clarke, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:45:43
Okay, Alex over to you you're on okay great. Thank you afternoon afternoon members of the committee
So Alex Clark, I'm one of the heads of service within
and Bus Franchising Directorate of the Combined Authority.
So thank you for having us today.
And I think you're absolutely right, Chair,
that there's a strong connexion here
between the programme to deliver Bus Franchising,
which myself and the team are looking after,
and our broader local transport plan,
to which it needs to contribute.
So I'll take the paper as broadly read,
but perhaps just for those slightly less familiar,
a bit of an outline in terms of the franchising programme
as a whole.
So the mayor took a decision in March 2024
to bring busses back under local control
by introducing a franchising scheme.
What that means in practise is that routes, frequencies,
fares, and the overall standards for busses in the region
will be set by the command authority,
so not by private operators who instead be contracted
to run services on the combined authorities behalf.
The objectives for that bus reform assessment
that kind of informed that decision are set out in the paper, but include a key theme
of green and better vehicles, recognising both the challenge of encouraging modal shift
and its impact on the environment, but also introducing zero emission busses to lower emission
standards.
And as has already rightly been pointed out, we've included some information in the paper
on the current fleet makeup in West Yorkshire, which is not too dissimilar to some of the
challenges nationally, but we have some particular local challenges at the moment in terms of
the replacement rate of vehicles during the last few years, particularly driven by things
like COVID -19 and a reduced investment from private operators.
So the programme for implementing franchising covers four years from the mayor's decision
to the introduction of all of the first franchise contracts for local services in West Yorkshire
by the end of 2028. Since that decision in March last year we've obviously been moving at pace
through phase one of the programme up to the beginning of first procurements which will be
later in this year. The Combined Authority has already taken a number of decisions during that
time including approvals and delegations around lotting so setting the basis for the bus services
to be provided within franchise contracts on depots so setting out the approach to the provision
of depot facilities and on fleet in developing a route to deliver the right number of vehicles
for both the planned and future franchise contracts.
And there's a further combined authority paper coming later this week at the combined authority
meeting with a central focus on the procurement approach.
So lots of activity live at the moment.
And there's some more detail on some of those strategies within the paper, but hopefully
that just gives a good overview of where we're at with the programme and opens up that wider
discussion.
Thank you.
Thank you, Alex, and sorry to spring that upon you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:48:44
Thank you for setting out the sequencing and the components of that bus franchising.
I think one of the messages is there are no overnight miracles, but there is a process
for taking back control of our bus services.
Now Gideon has been very patient and he's definitely first and then Councillor Soekal
I'll hear from.
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 1:49:18
Cllr Mohan Sokhal - 1:49:26
Thank you Chair. I got the experience of working as a bus driver myself. I worked on the bus for 40 years.
When the deregulation of busses brought in 1986, what happened that time?
Government was saying it's a competition. It wasn't competition.
What happened those days?
The cowboys, operators, they step in.
They were allowed to run the busses there.
with even one or two of busses, not a good standard busses, running in front of the main bus service, which was three minutes or two minutes.
They actually, those cowboy bus operators, they destroyed the bus services, which were already running before 1986.
So I'm well pleased now the West Yorkshire Combined Authority here bringing back the public, Bose -Sarawal public to the public control.
That's point. Bose, I want to make sure, I want to remind that it should not happen again under the franchise rule.
I read somewhere, it's a competition. I don't want to go back to that competition where the cow bus operator came in and destroyed the man who suffered that.
It's the main bus company suffered that. As a result of that, they withdrawn the busses from the routes.
And rather than going direct bus to one place to other place,
they started running bus service going through the village which would take one hour journey to take two hour journey.
The public needs the bus service. They need bus service fast and quick.
and short time journey not like being the journey from say from from
to white roses come take two hours used to take one hour now is going through
they come to take two hours that's the why we the bus company losing commercial
rules yeah because the people don't want to stay on the bus for two hours so they think it's better to go by some taxi or other place.
So I want to make sure it should not happen again and under the franchise system now.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:52:10
Thank you Councillor Silkle and those messages of 86 really do need to be learned.
I'm going to take Gideon and then I'm going to come back to Alex and Helen.
Thanks a lot.
Gideon Richards (Private Sector Representative) - 1:52:23
My first question actually was starting with commercial vehicle fleets and how we're going
to support and nurture those for actually reducing or changing their operating fleet.
And sort of linking to that, maybe then start thinking about,
we've got Park and Ride, we're talking about other forms of charging infrastructure,
especially bus networks, and are we thinking about whether those could be used for not only the bus network,
but also for other fleet users as well on the basis that they are going to have the

12 Bus Franchising

grid infrastructure there to cover that. And then the other one I was thinking about,
and we've got a number of local plans that are going to get updated shortly
and are being updated shortly, and are you talking to the local councils about land use and where
they're allocating land for things like the mass transit points and also multimodal hubs
and things like that because we're in danger if we're not careful of having something that
would have been ideal for a multimodal hub is actually now allocated as a housing estate
or something like that. So thank you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:53:52
Thank You Gideon I actually know the answer to the second part of that. So
Helen Alex very pertinent points from Councillor Soquel about the kind of
things that happened in 86 and as we go forward into bus franchising seeking
assurance in terms of some of those things not being allowed to happen again
and questions about operating fleet and spatial strategies
and revisions of local plans from Gideon.
Great, so if I take the first two of those questions
and then pass to Helen.
Alex Clarke, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:54:30
So absolutely, wasn't around in 86,
so can't comment on kind of what that felt like at the time
but I think the key thing to take
in terms of introducing franchising
is it gives much greater control
to that setting of the route, setting of the frequencies of service delivery.
So that ability for operators to change or to compete on the road is really replaced
with competition for franchise contracts and that's at the heart of the franchising proposition.
So hopefully that gives members some comfort in terms of the approach that we're taking
there as we introduce our first set of franchising contracts and obviously there's a longer term
piece to do to look at the network more generally once we've introduced
franchising in West Yorkshire. Just on picking up the point in terms of charging
infrastructure for busses and using it elsewhere, that is already happening with
some of the private operators that are doing at the moment with business -to -business
charging in some of the depots, certainly something that we're giving
consideration to in terms of the depot work about what else you
be able to do. Busses are often charged overnight which leaves kind of capacity
during the day. Obviously there are arrangements to get right in terms of
how you make that happen but it's certainly something that's being
considered. Thank you Alex and just to add to that just more broadly than picking
Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:55:59
up a point that was made earlier on in the committee. We did via the
Transport Committee in April adopt our electric vehicle infrastructure strategy
and we'll be bringing our
On street guidance for approval to transport committee tomorrow that's focused on cars
But I just wanted to flag it here because that helps us set out and how we're delivering our local
electric vehicle infrastructure funding which we received from from government two years ago
and so just just aligned kind of the
questions around kind of spatial spatial planning and the policies within the
within the local transport plan. To answer your question, yes we are working
with districts and we've been working with districts very closely. The local
transport plan has been co -developed with our district partners and mass transit
as specifically as its policy framework is baked into the local transport plan.
So transit orientated development is a policy that we have in
there to help enable and work together across that piece. I should
also make reference at this point to the spatial development strategy which will
be coming forward and and and become become a if you like a statute document
there'll be a working relationship between us and the district and the
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 1:57:30
district partners and as well perhaps I could add that the spatial strategy I
think has been to most of the districts because when you look exactly as Gideon
said when you look across the five districts we're all in different stages
of our local plans you know being already being reviewed you know various
stages and of course the danger is that you allocate land or in a different way
and that you fetter the ability for mass transit trams and and other transport
and so on to take place. So that's gone to each of the districts to take a look at.
Helen and Alex, can you also pick up the point, and I can't remember whether it was Councillor
Ravich or Martin, in terms of just addressing this question of the fact that we still have
Euro for diesel within the system in terms of the plans the fleet strategy
Where does hydrogen sit?
What the expectation is in terms of
Changing and decarbonizing that fleet and over what sort of period
Yeah, okay, so if I pick up pick up those points so in terms of kind of our bus reform assessment we set out and
The approach that we working towards zero emission fleets
by
Alex Clarke, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 1:58:55
2036 and that's actually already consistent with our bus service
improvement plan
What what we're looking at at the moment and obviously these are these are kind of active active considerations in the moment
Recognising we're in this transition phase is what does that period look like in terms of between now and then and also
The phasing out over time of those kind of lower standard your emission vehicles
clearly as we're kind of we're not yet there in terms of contracting
phase the exact final makeup of fleet isn't clear so apologies if
there's kind of some vagueness in my answer and members will recognise as
well obviously that we're currently in a process of kind of acquisition around
around both fleet and vehicles so there's some information that I won't be
able to kind of go into today but certainly the plan is there to look at
that kind of vehicle specification
for the start of contracts,
but then also how do we evolve and move over time?
How do we cascade vehicles in a different way
to what we see at the moment
in terms of that kind of private operator footprint,
but very much in view.
And then in terms of hydrogen,
again, it's something that's in view.
We've been agnostic in terms of our assessment,
in terms of what the kind of favoured long -term view is
of bus fuel.
We've done a study looking at hydrogen as well as looking at the options around battery
electric vehicles and again some of that further detail was in the fleet strategy we brought
to the combined authority in May.
Thank you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 2:00:35
There's a lot to think about and apologies John, it was you who raised the question of
diesel.
It's fine, thanks, Chair.
I
John Clark (Private Sector Representative) - 2:00:40
From what you're saying it does look as though
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 2:00:46
certainly in that short -term transitional period a
minority of vehicles
Are not going to be able to be electric and we would aim for them to be at least euro six in terms of diesel and
Hydrogen a possibility we don't know but I think one of the concerns of the smaller districts
is that we don't become a repository for older diesel vehicles, really, is a key thing.
Jim Cardwell, Advisory Representative (Northern Powergrid) - 2:01:22
Hi, Jim Carter, I work for Northern Power Grid. I was a complement for the paper because
I like the way it's both very integrated, a very wide scope as well, you've got a lot
it's integrated into other bits of transport,
as it needs to be.
I guess that it was a question about the sort of engagement
with the people who live or work in West Yorkshire,
and how you plan to do that.
Because I can see flickers of it
as I read through the different initiatives.
For example, I've seen comms go out on the Weaver network
and that branding that you talked about.
I guess I just wondered,
how are you approaching that whole engagement?
It's very visionary.
It's looking out far into the future,
and there's some big broad brush strokes
of less reliance on the car, more reliance on alternative.
So there's a cell and there's taking people with you
on that, so I just wondered how you were approaching
that question.
Over to you.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 2:02:19
Thank you, it's a really good question
because there's two levels to it
Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 2:02:26
and I think that's one of the challenges
but also one of the opportunities.
Obviously if you consult on a policy framework
on face value, it doesn't really wash. So it's about how are you making it real to the
public at large. So the launch of the Weaver brand and therefore our brand around our network
and our transport network gave us a real opportunity to provide us with a very visual ability to
sell and really show people what we mean and how we're going to demonstrate. So as you'll
see as the materials come out next week and through what we've been using through what's
called our talk in transport events which we've just concluded this round yesterday,
we are showing two levels of kind of visuals. So a high level kind of tube style map which
shows in broad terms how the network, mass transit, bus, rail kind of work together but
also how they are then integrated through a lot of images to really link between that
network and your door -to -door journey, so some of the physical improvements that are
more likely to happen within your neighbourhood areas.
So from a visual perspective, we're trying to demonstrate how this may look in the future.
From a practical perspective, we're doing a number of things. There's a number of online
webinars we'll be holding but also kind of very in person in public trying to
get up to a lot of community events and a lot of locations across all of West
Yorkshire different types so from high football places through to kind of focus
groups and different levels of conversation so a full spectrum of just
flaring and trying to catch people but also kind of having much longer
conversations and discussions and panel events as well as online. So kind of giving clients
give us the largest opportunity. We're also working with the voluntary sector
groups if you like to try and kind of expand our reach to some of the seldom heard groups.
So one of the things we've adapted from our approach to how we engaged last year was we
we felt we didn't hear from enough broad groups last year.
So we've been working in partnership with a vulture sector,
an organisation who has really good connexions with much broader groups.
So that's been a really positive experience
and helping us to really spread our conversation.
Because it really is about the conversation here
and understanding how we can make it real to people
and how they can really interact with what we want to deliver and see.
Thank you, Alan. Thank you for the question, Jim.
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 2:05:26
Cancer patient.
Thank you. And yeah, that's really helpful. Just to add a few things that were picked
Cllr Scott Patient Calderdale Council - 2:05:35
up via the talking transport thing that you ran the other day, this one happens to be
in Hebdon Bridge, which is quite well attended. A couple of the comments that came there from
the community were two things really.
Number one being to use your existing assets,
so things like bus shelters and stuff
to amplify those storeys, to get it out to more people
so more people can access it.
That's the digital side of it, whether that's through QR
or whether that's just through links or whatever,
strikes me as an easy achievable win.
And the second thing really was the idea
about utilising the people that you have in the communities and that's elected members.
You know, giving them the materials, not just digital packs but also flyers, posters and
stuff that they might need to then go where you can't go because with the best will in
the world, I know you will, I know you're connecting with the voluntary community sector
and doing that work but there are other places you can get to, other people you can connect
to with that hyper local sort of knowledge.
So, you know, use us and abuse us, so to speak.
There's a fair few hundred of us, I think,
isn't there in West Yorkshire.
So we're out there, thank you.
Thank you.
Is it on now?
Sure.
Thank you, thank you for your question.
I think just that first point, yeah,
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 2:06:54
Helen Ellerton, Officer (West Yorkshire Combined Authority) - 2:06:55
we are trying to understand kind of how we can get things
out, if you like, in different formats
across different ways.
And as Alex will know, the 14 ,000 bus stops
across the region are one way.
It's just about how we manage some of this
across some of our key places
where we get higher footfall across the bus stops.
Just on your second point, yes, absolutely,
and I'm hoping you've had an invite in
for the mayor's briefing to the ward councillors
on Thursday evening.
And that session is to allow the mayor
to talk to all ward councillors
and really bring them into the fold to help you,
you articulate the messages and go from there excellent and go from there to help us spread the word and get your engagement
Thank you, um, and I'm I'm thinking this committee is looking
Cllr Jane Scullion (Calderdale Council) - 2:07:48
casting envious eyes on those 14 ,000 bus stops
and I think home energy West Yorkshire is one of the first in the queue in terms of
advertising for the combined authority and
I'm conscious of the time, folks.
And I'm also confident that this is a dialogue, this is a conversation, isn't it, in terms
of what the combined authority as we said about some of the skills development earlier,
this is a dialogue between the different parts of the combined authority that's going to
continue.
And I hope you found the questions and the challenges useful, really.
committee. We would like you to come back. Actually, if that's all right. You don't have
to stay for the whole committee. But that's extremely useful.
Committee, we have to note the local transport plan for the statutory consultation that's
coming up. We're asked as a committee to publicise the consultation with our own networks, really,
in terms of the local transport plan. So encourage as wide a range as possible.
And let's face it, all of your organisations and indeed your councils, we all employ lots
of people. They travel to their places of work very often when they're not working at
home. And make sure that actually people do as wide a range of people as possible do have
their say. And in terms of the bus franchising, this
was the first, Alex, of other updates that we hope we're going to have. And I think you
can hear from the tenor of the questions some of the things that this committee are particularly
interested in. So if the committee are happy to note those two reports with those comments.
Thank you. Thank you, Helen. Thank you, Alex, very much.
I'm going to close in a moment the formal part of this meeting. And the next meeting
of this committee, it seems too far away, doesn't it, actually, is on the 4th of November.
This has been very much, you know, first meeting of the municipal year, very much noting and
endorsing seeing progress. I think the next meeting, and it's already been trailed, actually,
some of the things that are very much coming to this meeting and we look forward to that.
I know that some of you have to go. We're going to have a short break and there's then
an opportunity for a private members workshop just updating members on some additional items.
So thank you all very much for your contributions and look forward to working with you whether
you remain member or a sub. Look forward to working with you and to seeing the officers
again next time on the 4th of November. Thank you.